Adam Torres and Mohamed Hamza discuss becoming an executive coach.
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Show Notes:
The executive coaching landscape is evolving. In this episode, Adam Torres and Mohamed Hamza, Senior Director, Client Success at Mercer Talent Enterprise, explore Mohamed’s journey as a coach and how he is helping others succeed.
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About Mohamed Hamza
Mohamed Hamza is an international leadership development expert, and has worked as a facilitator, assessor, and coach in over 10 countries across the GCC, Europe and Africa. Currently he is holding the title of Leadership Principal L&D Consultant in Elm company, responsible for the design, development, and delivery of various leadership development solutions to clients, these solutions are mostly learning journeys that includes assessment, training, and coaching, among other learning elements.
Hamza is an ICF (International Coach Federation) coach, and holds the ICF PCC credentials, he is an internationally certified assessor and center manager by A&AC UK, and an internationally certified assessor from Saville Assessments UK, Thomas International UK and Profiles International USA. He is also a certified trainer for the American University in Cairo, Reflact AG in Germany, and The Leadership Challenge in the USA. Hamza is one of the AUC Triple-Crown University faculty staff. He also teaches ICF certification qualifying programs in a New York based international school of coaching Goal Imagery Institute.
About Mercer Talent Enterprise
At Mercer Talent Enterprise, we’re a global leader in talent assessment, technology, and leadership development, part of Mercer. As the world’s first and only company to pioneer the science of Behaviourmetrics®, we offer cutting-edge solutions for talent assessment and capability development.
Our expertise provides unparalleled insights into individuals, teams, and organizations, empowering you to make critical talent decisions on your most pivotal people priorities. Through collaboration with governments, employers, and educators, we contribute to thriving communities by applying positive behavioral science alongside the latest advancements in artificial intelligence and machine learning.
With a fast-expanding global network of offices and partners, we work with over 350+ clients across Asia Pacific, Middle East and Africa, UK and Europe as well as North America.
Lighthouse, our flagship employee assessment technology platform, offers an unmatched range of psychometric tests, virtual assessment solutions, and organizational surveys—all accessible on a single platform. With timely, immersive virtual test experiences, real-time data analytics, and dynamic dashboards, we provide invaluable support to our clients in addressing their most critical career guidance, recruitment, talent identification, leadership development, skilling, and succession planning priorities. We measure aspects such as personality, strengths, motives, values, cognitive ability, and demonstrated behavioral and leadership attributes to ensure comprehensive and effective solutions for our clients.
Full Unedited Transcript
Hey, I’d like to welcome you to another episode of mission matters. My name is Adam Torres. And if you’d like to apply to be a guest in the show, just head on over to mission matters. com and click on be our guest to apply. All right. So today my guest is Mohammed Hamza and he’s senior director of client success over at Mercer talent enterprise.
Hamza, welcome to the show. Thank you very much. Thank you for having me, Adam. All right. So we got a lot to talk about today. So I want to get into executive coaching. I definitely want to talk a little bit about what you’re doing over at Mercer Talent Enterprise as well a bit. But before we get started, I like to start this interview the way that we start them all with what we like to call our Mission Matters Minute.
So Hamza, we at Mission Matters, we amplify stories for entrepreneurs, executives, and experts. That’s our mission. Hamza, what mission matters to you? First of all, I really like your mission. That’s really interesting. My mission is basically, I think it’s a really wide question. I can answer it in so many different ways, but for me, what stands out is normally developing, generally developing people.
And more specifically developing leaders. I think I always see the impact of this on people and our organizations. I see the impact of good people, good leaders and the impact of not really good leaders on organizations. So I think it’s it’s really important thing. And I I think this is my mission.
So let, I kind of want to go back a bit here. So when did you get interested in this concept of like leadership, being a leader, like getting, getting, helping others in leadership, like where did that start for you? So normally people get interested in, in leadership development, or if they’re interested in leadership development further in their careers.
For me, it was a little bit different because it was just when I started my career. So when I, when I joined my first company, I was really lucky because my company, just as I joined, they were winning an award. we’re a com. We’re winning a competition, basically. And the award was that they will develop their people, the employees with top US business schools, top global business schools, basically.
And I was really eager to learn. I I wanted to understand about this stuff. And the first program I attended was about leadership. It was called the Leadership Challenge. And it was it, it fascinated me like how the, the awareness that I got, I didn’t have any leadership experience, right. But, but the way I saw people around me and the awareness I got about myself and how I can become a leader regardless of the titles and everything, I think this, this, this is how it started, right?
So started really early in my career. Yeah. And so how did you in the beginning, obviously at work, you had a certain amount of infrastructure there, right? With the leaders around you, maybe some training programs and other things they may have had in place. But how did you start to, in those early days, how did you start to like tool up?
How did you start to, you know, build your tool set? Yeah. So as I told you, I was really lucky. Right. So I was working in an organization where I was not really paid well, but everything else was good. Right. So it’s always pros and cons, right? Hamza, it’s the scales of life, right? Yeah. So really strange, but I mean, they develop you like crazy.
Right. So, so the development was amazing. Really good people. And I had a lot of opportunities to grow and to learn and to experience. So again, to be honest, the first thing was the people around me and the resources I was provided. So I was just joining an organization coming out of university and getting top executive school training from everywhere in the U S mostly us business schools, but it was amazing.
Like Harvard, Stanford, all like famous business schools. I was getting really deep training. Around all of this stuff. So I had the sources of, of the resources of knowledge in general. That was like, that was a lot, right? So it was really easy for me to learn, to be honest. And as you started developing your skill set and you start moving up and, and you know, the corporate side of things, at what point did you feel, or maybe it was a progression, maybe it was something, I don’t, I don’t want to put words into your mouth, but at what point did you feel that that like, this was something that you were going to be doing for a long time?
Like, and what I mean by that is you’re going to be helping and wanting to like tip over and start developing other leaders. Like when did that happen? Yeah, well. Well, as, as you said, normally it happens to people as they progress in their careers. Right. So, but it also didn’t happen to me. This way happened to me like early on, once I saw what this person did in this room.
Wow. So you wanted develop other leaders early on, even so you are obsessed with the idea and then you wanted to, you wanted to get in the game. Yeah. Yeah, because, because I saw the impact as I was sitting in the room and saw how this person is really helping me and everybody else in this room, I said, that’s exactly.
What I want to do. And that’s why I started everything really early. So I started doing, so I’m a faculty now in multiple business schools, but I started delivering training when I was like 21 or 22, that’s really early, really early. It helped me that I looked older. But I was always the young facilitator who people would say how old are you?
Would just to talk to me about leadership, right? So what kind of experience you have, but it was the, yeah. So when I was early in my career, I was a financial advisor. And when I was like, so my come from background is in finance. I’m not, I’m not in that profession anymore. Don’t have any licenses. But when I was when I was starting out, I always felt like.
especially looking back now. It’s like I’m early, early twenties and I’m helping people make investment decisions that are retiring. Kind of interesting how that works, but you know, and I, I bring that up only because the mechanics, the tools, like the infrastructure, I found that even at that age, I could help others.
So, because. You were already studying and you were, you had the infrastructure, you had the tools, you had everything else, even though maybe you didn’t have the life experience yet. I’m bet that you were able to help a lot of people really. Cause that, cause you had the infrastructure. Definitely. I also studied finance by the way.
Yeah, but I but I, but again, so once I saw this, I think this is what started it for me and for. For our topic today, when, what, if we speak about coaching, what started this for me was when I attended the first coaching session. So it’s always when I, when I was on the receiving side of the service or the business, I was saying, okay, so for coaching, it was, for me, it was really strange because the coach didn’t tell me to do anything.
And it’s something that I’ve been thinking about for so long, but I don’t know what happened. How did I find the solution? You got to tell me more about that. Tell me, tell me this story about how that happened. I was in a tough situation where it’s a, it’s a very long story. I don’t want to go through it, but I mean, I was in a tough situation with business partnership and I was feeling really bad about a situation.
And I didn’t know what to do. I was feeling lost basically. And that was the only thing I was thinking about in my life. But I wake up, I think about this and asleep thinking about the same thing. It’s like. That’s the only thing I was thinking about. But then I was attending a training and as part of the training, there was some coaching sessions provided and they said, okay, who wants to volunteer?
To be coached and I said, okay, let me bring this and see if this coaching works. Right. So, and and when I discussed this and the coach was amazing also but when I discussed this, it brought completely different energy. The coach didn’t tell me to do anything, but I knew exactly what I’m going to do.
Yeah. You know, Because because it’s really different. It’s really strange. You have to try it, right? So it’s really different than when you think about something or when you speak about it with someone who’s not giving you a solution and you’re not whining about it. Very different when you whine about something.
Okay. That’s sometimes you need to blow off some steam. That’s fine. I mean, when you speak with a coach, like you, you have a conversation with the purpose. It’s not just a conversation to blow off steam. Yeah, so the energy it brought to me, it was really strange and I know exactly what I have to do and I did it and it was.
Done for me. So I thought, you know what, I’m definitely going to do this. So, yeah. What was your, so, okay. So now you’ve been on the receiving end of being a coach and now what was that next step for you? When, when, when did it click when you’re like, you know what, not only am I on the receiving end, but I want to help others.
I want to be a coach. How did that happen? Yeah. Yeah. So, so that was exactly right after. This session, I said, you know what? So I’ve been in the business pretty fast. It sounds like early in your career, you run this leadership path, you do a coaching session right after you’re like, Hey, I’m in, this is for me.
Like, yeah, let’s do this. Yeah. To be honest, it’s also relevant to my business, right? So I was in a very similar business in general. And when I, when I got the opportunity to experience this, I saw, I thought, you know what, it’s just. Like really like mind blowing. So I thought I definitely want to do this.
I’ve been helping or trying to help people in general or in the same business. So I thought, you know what, I’ll have to go through this. It’s a, and it’s not an easy journey. It’s not, it’s not, it’s not a hard journey, but I mean, it’s a. It’s a journey that you need to work for. You don’t become a coach like this.
You don’t attend a couple of days of training and you’re a coach, right? Yeah. Because so many people would read an article about coaching. And the next day it was saying, I’m coach Hamza. You know, it’s like, it doesn’t work this way. Because otherwise, if you’re not really well trained, if you’re not really well prepared to become a coach, you’ll ruin.
Other people’s lives. So you need to know what to do. Right. Yeah. So yeah. And you’ve worked correct me if I’m wrong. So both you mentioned schooling in the United States, but you’re international, right? You’ve worked internationally, work international, this, but this transcends like countries, different things.
Right. Talk to me a little bit about that. Cause that’s interesting to me. Yeah, so it’s a big part of me is that I believe like big part of my philosophy in general in life is that it’s really strange for me. It’s not just a philosophy. It’s reality, right? But it’s really strange for me to feel as a stranger anywhere ago.
So if I visit any country. I feel like, you know, it’s like, you’re my people, this is my country, you know, it’s like, it’s a home everywhere. No, no. Home now is home in Riyadh now, but I mean, in general, I don’t feel as a stranger. That’s what I don’t feel. So if I go anywhere so I can feel home in multiple places, really.
So when I go to Egypt, obviously, because originally I’m from Egypt. So when I’m, when I go to Egypt, obviously I feel home. Riyadh is mostly home for me. Because that’s where I live. And when I go to Switzerland, I feel like I’m home, like many places, but even like, even if I go to Hong Kong, which is.
Different than what I lived or traveled and worked and everything like first time for me, fine. I don’t feel like a stranger. I’m the only one who’s looking like this, but it’s fine. You know, it’s like completely fine for me. So, because I believe that again, the earth was not, it was not created for like people to stay in like their own circles and so on.
And I always like to learn about locals where I go. Yeah. Right. So almost a hundred percent of my friends in Saudi Arabia are Saudis. Yeah. And so for like the coaching side of things, do you find that also transcends borders? Cause I feel like people are people everywhere, obviously like leadership skills and things like that are going to vary cultures vary, but like, what, what does that look like?
I mean, I’m just interested to see from your vantage point. Point because I’ve talked to maybe some other coaches as well, but they’re not necessarily international or doing things international. So I’m curious like how that, and I don’t want to generalize, obviously you named a lot of countries. So I’m not saying that coaching in Hong Kong versus Saudi Arabia versus Egypt.
I’m not saying they’re all the same, but I know there’s probably some themes and some other sensitivities that you keep in mind as you’re working across borders. Yeah, well, definitely. That’s a really good question. So I think culture plays a big role in this. So you need to be aware of culture. So cultures can be different, and you need to be aware of this.
This is really important. I think in every business you do, but especially in something that’s more sensitive, like coaching or leadership development or assessment or stuff like you need to be aware of the culture and there are differences in cultures. Yeah. Yeah, but in addition to the difference that what actually brought me to this awareness or this philosophy of or the feeling that I don’t feel really like a stranger is exactly what you mentioned, right?
Like people are people. Very similar. I can meet someone in Switzerland who lived a completely different life than mine, but then I have a lot in common with this person and much more in common than the person who, that my neighbor who grew up with me, you know people are people. They share very similar problems.
Very similar issues, very similar goals, like really people are people. So cultures can be different. Yes. And you need to be aware of this. You need to recognize this, but then people are really people very similar. I want to, I want to switch up the topic a bit here and I want to, I want to go in another direction.
Let’s so now we’ve talked about so far, you know, your beginning in leadership and then also in coaching. What inspires you? started. Now let’s like, you’ve obviously had a rich and rewarding, rewarding experience from being a coach. And now I know we’ve talked offline and one of your goals is to help inspire others to, you know, become coaches and do other and, and, and kind of go down those same things to help people go down that same track.
What, like what inspired this in you? Like what made you want to like inspire others to also become coaches as well? How, how, how does that come up? That’s also a good question. So I think it’s what, what makes it important for me is because of the impact I see with coaching and the impact I see also with how you change when you learn and how you, when you become a coach, because.
It’s not only the business, but business part is really important, right? So it’s like we all need to survive. So, and it’s really good from coaching, but I mean, it’s what really inspires me is how people change when they become coaches, because it changes you in so many different levels. So it gives you, so for example, coaching is not about, is, has to do more about listening than about talking, but you become much more influential.
When you become a coach, yeah, you’re much more patient. So your patience level is much higher. It spills over into personal life too. It sounds like, right? Like either, either side, like work personal, like it makes you, I think it may give you a better, like overall, like, like view of the world, in my opinion, when you’re helping others like that.
A hundred percent, a hundred percent. And when, and when others become vulnerable, when they speak with you, It changes you, right? And when you see the struggles of everyone around you, which comes to the previous point you were mentioning the struggles of everyone around you, you see everybody has their own story, their own struggles, their own issues on their own goals, and they want to reach somewhere.
And they’re different than their approaches, but then very similar in, in regards to everything else, you know, so what changes you is really important. And actually, so what changes in the coach when they become a coach? I think this really inspires me. And when I see people who I trained, for example, to become coaches, when I see them helping others.
And telling me stories about how did they work with this organization or this person and how did they manage to help this person overcome something maybe they were struggling with for years, but then in a couple of sessions when they had the opportunity to open up and discuss. Now they’re over it. So this is really fulfilling.
Yeah. It’s interesting how that happens. And then it’s almost like I don’t know if this is the right word, but it’s, I’ve talked to many coaches through the years and it almost becomes like an addiction, the want to help people and the want to, like, when you see a new client or new person and you feel that energy and you can’t, I mean, you, you know, that, you know, on the other end of a process and helping them that there can be a breakthrough and that can be, you know, they can be better.
They don’t have to live with. Maybe what they’ve been struggling with for so long in many different ways. So that want to help people just becomes like something you’re compelled to do. I think it’s, it’s awesome. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes, which is a challenge as well. Sometimes people take it too far. So I know that again, my purpose is to help the client that I’m working with, but then I don’t really, sometimes people overdo it to reach the breakthrough.
We have to have a breakthrough, right? Yeah, I have to, it doesn’t work this way. Yeah. It has to come really natural. Otherwise it’s not going to happen, you know? Yeah. So so it definitely, it is fulfilling when it happens, but you shouldn’t expect it to happen every day. Not all every coaching session, you see a great breakthrough and people are like, like solving all the, it doesn’t work this way.
Right. So it does in the movies, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And some coaches actually that thrive for this too much that it’s actually They become pushy. They’re not doing coaching. And so, so that’s not, that’s not how it works, but when it happens, it is definitely fulfilling. So Hamza, you mentioned training others to, to become coaches or guiding them on the path as well.
Like, like talk to me a little bit about how that works. When people you have different, again, different purposes of you trying to learn about coaching. So some people learn about coaching to become executive coaches. And some people learn about coaching to have the skill of coaching, because when you have a coaching skill, you can do so many things better.
You’re a better leader, for example. So one of the things I’m doing with my company, we’re offering a program for the leader as a coach, right? So coaching skills for leaders. So, and it qualifies you to become a coach if you want at the end, right? But I mean, the main focus is. How to have the coaching skills and utilize them with your team because I can see the difference when the leader has some coaching skills instead of just telling me everything they just they ask me and they listen to me and their patient and their they bring the solution from within.
Not just tell me what to do. So, so it depends on the path you would like to go through, but in general, you have to, you have to be trained to become a coach. You have to be trained. That’s the first step always, but then there are also other steps. So you need to do mentoring hours. Maybe you need to do like a record.
You need to work on your craft always. It’s, it’s a craft and it’s not like when you attend two, three days of training, that’s it. You’re fine. You can go and do it. It doesn’t work this way. It’s a skill that needs some time to, to acquire, right? I cannot tell you that I’m going to teach you to swim in three days and you’ll be amazed.
No, that’s not how it works. Yeah, well, well, Hamza, I just have to say, man, it’s been great having you on the show and learning more about what you’re doing and also just your passion for coaching. It comes through, comes, jumps right through the camera. I just have to ask, what’s next? I mean, what’s next for you?
What’s next for the coaching? What’s next for leadership? Like what’s next on your plate? Well, what’s next for me? It’s a, it’s a big question, to be honest. I think for me, it’s I really want to achieve great things with my company. And five days I will be here for. Almost a year and i love this company and i see great future there’s so many things i would like to do in this domain and personally i think one of the things is i would like to.
I have some free time to maybe write something about leadership and coaching. Get some, and some leadership content, man. You’ve been studying for a long time. I’m in, I’m in, I already got it. I see it. I see it. I’m excited about it. I know this is just a one, one piece of your plan is is getting more out there to, to inspire others, and I love to see you continue to create content.
So I think it’s amazing that being said, if somebody’s watching this to listening to this, and if they want to follow up, cause they maybe want to learn. Mercer talent enterprise, or they want to learn about the coaching side of things or anything else. I mean, what’s the best way for people to follow your journey?
I think LinkedIn would be the best channel for people to reach me and I’m sure you’ll make this available for people. So so yeah, I think LinkedIn would be the. Yeah. So for everybody watching this, we’ll put the link to to the show or excuse me, to Hamza’s LinkedIn profile, all that other good stuff in the show notes, so you can just click on the links and head right on over and speaking of the audience, if this is your first time with mission matters and you haven’t done it yet, hit that subscribe button because we have many more mission based individuals coming up on the line and we don’t want you to miss a thing.
Hamza again, thank you so much for coming on the show and I can’t wait till the next time. I thank you. Thank you very much, Adam. That was lovely. Thank you so much.
Hey, I’d like to welcome you to another episode of mission matters. My name is Adam Torres. And if you’d like to apply to be a guest in the show, just head on over to mission matters. com and click on be our guest to apply. All right. So today my guest is Mohammed Hamza and he’s senior director of client success over at Mercer talent enterprise.
Hamza, welcome to the show. Thank you very much. Thank you for having me, Adam. All right. So we got a lot to talk about today. So I want to get into executive coaching. I definitely want to talk a little bit about what you’re doing over at Mercer Talent Enterprise as well a bit. But before we get started, I like to start this interview the way that we start them all with what we like to call our Mission Matters Minute.
So Hamza, we at Mission Matters, we amplify stories for entrepreneurs, executives, and experts. That’s our mission. Hamza, what mission matters to you? First of all, I really like your mission. That’s really interesting. My mission is basically, I think it’s a really wide question. I can answer it in so many different ways, but for me, what stands out is normally developing, generally developing people.
And more specifically developing leaders. I think I always see the impact of this on people and our organizations. I see the impact of good people, good leaders and the impact of not really good leaders on organizations. So I think it’s it’s really important thing. And I I think this is my mission.
So let, I kind of want to go back a bit here. So when did you get interested in this concept of like leadership, being a leader, like getting, getting, helping others in leadership, like where did that start for you? So normally people get interested in, in leadership development, or if they’re interested in leadership development further in their careers.
For me, it was a little bit different because it was just when I started my career. So when I, when I joined my first company, I was really lucky because my company, just as I joined, they were winning an award. we’re a com. We’re winning a competition, basically. And the award was that they will develop their people, the employees with top US business schools, top global business schools, basically.
And I was really eager to learn. I I wanted to understand about this stuff. And the first program I attended was about leadership. It was called the Leadership Challenge. And it was it, it fascinated me like how the, the awareness that I got, I didn’t have any leadership experience, right. But, but the way I saw people around me and the awareness I got about myself and how I can become a leader regardless of the titles and everything, I think this, this, this is how it started, right?
So started really early in my career. Yeah. And so how did you in the beginning, obviously at work, you had a certain amount of infrastructure there, right? With the leaders around you, maybe some training programs and other things they may have had in place. But how did you start to, in those early days, how did you start to like tool up?
How did you start to, you know, build your tool set? Yeah. So as I told you, I was really lucky. Right. So I was working in an organization where I was not really paid well, but everything else was good. Right. So it’s always pros and cons, right? Hamza, it’s the scales of life, right? Yeah. So really strange, but I mean, they develop you like crazy.
Right. So, so the development was amazing. Really good people. And I had a lot of opportunities to grow and to learn and to experience. So again, to be honest, the first thing was the people around me and the resources I was provided. So I was just joining an organization coming out of university and getting top executive school training from everywhere in the U S mostly us business schools, but it was amazing.
Like Harvard, Stanford, all like famous business schools. I was getting really deep training. Around all of this stuff. So I had the sources of, of the resources of knowledge in general. That was like, that was a lot, right? So it was really easy for me to learn, to be honest. And as you started developing your skill set and you start moving up and, and you know, the corporate side of things, at what point did you feel, or maybe it was a progression, maybe it was something, I don’t, I don’t want to put words into your mouth, but at what point did you feel that that like, this was something that you were going to be doing for a long time?
Like, and what I mean by that is you’re going to be helping and wanting to like tip over and start developing other leaders. Like when did that happen? Yeah, well. Well, as, as you said, normally it happens to people as they progress in their careers. Right. So, but it also didn’t happen to me. This way happened to me like early on, once I saw what this person did in this room.
Wow. So you wanted develop other leaders early on, even so you are obsessed with the idea and then you wanted to, you wanted to get in the game. Yeah. Yeah, because, because I saw the impact as I was sitting in the room and saw how this person is really helping me and everybody else in this room, I said, that’s exactly.
What I want to do. And that’s why I started everything really early. So I started doing, so I’m a faculty now in multiple business schools, but I started delivering training when I was like 21 or 22, that’s really early, really early. It helped me that I looked older. But I was always the young facilitator who people would say how old are you?
Would just to talk to me about leadership, right? So what kind of experience you have, but it was the, yeah. So when I was early in my career, I was a financial advisor. And when I was like, so my come from background is in finance. I’m not, I’m not in that profession anymore. Don’t have any licenses. But when I was when I was starting out, I always felt like.
especially looking back now. It’s like I’m early, early twenties and I’m helping people make investment decisions that are retiring. Kind of interesting how that works, but you know, and I, I bring that up only because the mechanics, the tools, like the infrastructure, I found that even at that age, I could help others.
So, because. You were already studying and you were, you had the infrastructure, you had the tools, you had everything else, even though maybe you didn’t have the life experience yet. I’m bet that you were able to help a lot of people really. Cause that, cause you had the infrastructure. Definitely. I also studied finance by the way.
Yeah, but I but I, but again, so once I saw this, I think this is what started it for me and for. For our topic today, when, what, if we speak about coaching, what started this for me was when I attended the first coaching session. So it’s always when I, when I was on the receiving side of the service or the business, I was saying, okay, so for coaching, it was, for me, it was really strange because the coach didn’t tell me to do anything.
And it’s something that I’ve been thinking about for so long, but I don’t know what happened. How did I find the solution? You got to tell me more about that. Tell me, tell me this story about how that happened. I was in a tough situation where it’s a, it’s a very long story. I don’t want to go through it, but I mean, I was in a tough situation with business partnership and I was feeling really bad about a situation.
And I didn’t know what to do. I was feeling lost basically. And that was the only thing I was thinking about in my life. But I wake up, I think about this and asleep thinking about the same thing. It’s like. That’s the only thing I was thinking about. But then I was attending a training and as part of the training, there was some coaching sessions provided and they said, okay, who wants to volunteer?
To be coached and I said, okay, let me bring this and see if this coaching works. Right. So, and and when I discussed this and the coach was amazing also but when I discussed this, it brought completely different energy. The coach didn’t tell me to do anything, but I knew exactly what I’m going to do.
Yeah. You know, Because because it’s really different. It’s really strange. You have to try it, right? So it’s really different than when you think about something or when you speak about it with someone who’s not giving you a solution and you’re not whining about it. Very different when you whine about something.
Okay. That’s sometimes you need to blow off some steam. That’s fine. I mean, when you speak with a coach, like you, you have a conversation with the purpose. It’s not just a conversation to blow off steam. Yeah, so the energy it brought to me, it was really strange and I know exactly what I have to do and I did it and it was.
Done for me. So I thought, you know what, I’m definitely going to do this. So, yeah. What was your, so, okay. So now you’ve been on the receiving end of being a coach and now what was that next step for you? When, when, when did it click when you’re like, you know what, not only am I on the receiving end, but I want to help others.
I want to be a coach. How did that happen? Yeah. Yeah. So, so that was exactly right after. This session, I said, you know what? So I’ve been in the business pretty fast. It sounds like early in your career, you run this leadership path, you do a coaching session right after you’re like, Hey, I’m in, this is for me.
Like, yeah, let’s do this. Yeah. To be honest, it’s also relevant to my business, right? So I was in a very similar business in general. And when I, when I got the opportunity to experience this, I saw, I thought, you know what, it’s just. Like really like mind blowing. So I thought I definitely want to do this.
I’ve been helping or trying to help people in general or in the same business. So I thought, you know what, I’ll have to go through this. It’s a, and it’s not an easy journey. It’s not, it’s not, it’s not a hard journey, but I mean, it’s a. It’s a journey that you need to work for. You don’t become a coach like this.
You don’t attend a couple of days of training and you’re a coach, right? Yeah. Because so many people would read an article about coaching. And the next day it was saying, I’m coach Hamza. You know, it’s like, it doesn’t work this way. Because otherwise, if you’re not really well trained, if you’re not really well prepared to become a coach, you’ll ruin.
Other people’s lives. So you need to know what to do. Right. Yeah. So yeah. And you’ve worked correct me if I’m wrong. So both you mentioned schooling in the United States, but you’re international, right? You’ve worked internationally, work international, this, but this transcends like countries, different things.
Right. Talk to me a little bit about that. Cause that’s interesting to me. Yeah, so it’s a big part of me is that I believe like big part of my philosophy in general in life is that it’s really strange for me. It’s not just a philosophy. It’s reality, right? But it’s really strange for me to feel as a stranger anywhere ago.
So if I visit any country. I feel like, you know, it’s like, you’re my people, this is my country, you know, it’s like, it’s a home everywhere. No, no. Home now is home in Riyadh now, but I mean, in general, I don’t feel as a stranger. That’s what I don’t feel. So if I go anywhere so I can feel home in multiple places, really.
So when I go to Egypt, obviously, because originally I’m from Egypt. So when I’m, when I go to Egypt, obviously I feel home. Riyadh is mostly home for me. Because that’s where I live. And when I go to Switzerland, I feel like I’m home, like many places, but even like, even if I go to Hong Kong, which is.
Different than what I lived or traveled and worked and everything like first time for me, fine. I don’t feel like a stranger. I’m the only one who’s looking like this, but it’s fine. You know, it’s like completely fine for me. So, because I believe that again, the earth was not, it was not created for like people to stay in like their own circles and so on.
And I always like to learn about locals where I go. Yeah. Right. So almost a hundred percent of my friends in Saudi Arabia are Saudis. Yeah. And so for like the coaching side of things, do you find that also transcends borders? Cause I feel like people are people everywhere, obviously like leadership skills and things like that are going to vary cultures vary, but like, what, what does that look like?
I mean, I’m just interested to see from your vantage point. Point because I’ve talked to maybe some other coaches as well, but they’re not necessarily international or doing things international. So I’m curious like how that, and I don’t want to generalize, obviously you named a lot of countries. So I’m not saying that coaching in Hong Kong versus Saudi Arabia versus Egypt.
I’m not saying they’re all the same, but I know there’s probably some themes and some other sensitivities that you keep in mind as you’re working across borders. Yeah, well, definitely. That’s a really good question. So I think culture plays a big role in this. So you need to be aware of culture. So cultures can be different, and you need to be aware of this.
This is really important. I think in every business you do, but especially in something that’s more sensitive, like coaching or leadership development or assessment or stuff like you need to be aware of the culture and there are differences in cultures. Yeah. Yeah, but in addition to the difference that what actually brought me to this awareness or this philosophy of or the feeling that I don’t feel really like a stranger is exactly what you mentioned, right?
Like people are people. Very similar. I can meet someone in Switzerland who lived a completely different life than mine, but then I have a lot in common with this person and much more in common than the person who, that my neighbor who grew up with me, you know people are people. They share very similar problems.
Very similar issues, very similar goals, like really people are people. So cultures can be different. Yes. And you need to be aware of this. You need to recognize this, but then people are really people very similar. I want to, I want to switch up the topic a bit here and I want to, I want to go in another direction.
Let’s so now we’ve talked about so far, you know, your beginning in leadership and then also in coaching. What inspires you? started. Now let’s like, you’ve obviously had a rich and rewarding, rewarding experience from being a coach. And now I know we’ve talked offline and one of your goals is to help inspire others to, you know, become coaches and do other and, and, and kind of go down those same things to help people go down that same track.
What, like what inspired this in you? Like what made you want to like inspire others to also become coaches as well? How, how, how does that come up? That’s also a good question. So I think it’s what, what makes it important for me is because of the impact I see with coaching and the impact I see also with how you change when you learn and how you, when you become a coach, because.
It’s not only the business, but business part is really important, right? So it’s like we all need to survive. So, and it’s really good from coaching, but I mean, it’s what really inspires me is how people change when they become coaches, because it changes you in so many different levels. So it gives you, so for example, coaching is not about, is, has to do more about listening than about talking, but you become much more influential.
When you become a coach, yeah, you’re much more patient. So your patience level is much higher. It spills over into personal life too. It sounds like, right? Like either, either side, like work personal, like it makes you, I think it may give you a better, like overall, like, like view of the world, in my opinion, when you’re helping others like that.
A hundred percent, a hundred percent. And when, and when others become vulnerable, when they speak with you, It changes you, right? And when you see the struggles of everyone around you, which comes to the previous point you were mentioning the struggles of everyone around you, you see everybody has their own story, their own struggles, their own issues on their own goals, and they want to reach somewhere.
And they’re different than their approaches, but then very similar in, in regards to everything else, you know, so what changes you is really important. And actually, so what changes in the coach when they become a coach? I think this really inspires me. And when I see people who I trained, for example, to become coaches, when I see them helping others.
And telling me stories about how did they work with this organization or this person and how did they manage to help this person overcome something maybe they were struggling with for years, but then in a couple of sessions when they had the opportunity to open up and discuss. Now they’re over it. So this is really fulfilling.
Yeah. It’s interesting how that happens. And then it’s almost like I don’t know if this is the right word, but it’s, I’ve talked to many coaches through the years and it almost becomes like an addiction, the want to help people and the want to, like, when you see a new client or new person and you feel that energy and you can’t, I mean, you, you know, that, you know, on the other end of a process and helping them that there can be a breakthrough and that can be, you know, they can be better.
They don’t have to live with. Maybe what they’ve been struggling with for so long in many different ways. So that want to help people just becomes like something you’re compelled to do. I think it’s, it’s awesome. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes, which is a challenge as well. Sometimes people take it too far. So I know that again, my purpose is to help the client that I’m working with, but then I don’t really, sometimes people overdo it to reach the breakthrough.
We have to have a breakthrough, right? Yeah, I have to, it doesn’t work this way. Yeah. It has to come really natural. Otherwise it’s not going to happen, you know? Yeah. So so it definitely, it is fulfilling when it happens, but you shouldn’t expect it to happen every day. Not all every coaching session, you see a great breakthrough and people are like, like solving all the, it doesn’t work this way.
Right. So it does in the movies, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And some coaches actually that thrive for this too much that it’s actually They become pushy. They’re not doing coaching. And so, so that’s not, that’s not how it works, but when it happens, it is definitely fulfilling. So Hamza, you mentioned training others to, to become coaches or guiding them on the path as well.
Like, like talk to me a little bit about how that works. When people you have different, again, different purposes of you trying to learn about coaching. So some people learn about coaching to become executive coaches. And some people learn about coaching to have the skill of coaching, because when you have a coaching skill, you can do so many things better.
You’re a better leader, for example. So one of the things I’m doing with my company, we’re offering a program for the leader as a coach, right? So coaching skills for leaders. So, and it qualifies you to become a coach if you want at the end, right? But I mean, the main focus is. How to have the coaching skills and utilize them with your team because I can see the difference when the leader has some coaching skills instead of just telling me everything they just they ask me and they listen to me and their patient and their they bring the solution from within.
Not just tell me what to do. So, so it depends on the path you would like to go through, but in general, you have to, you have to be trained to become a coach. You have to be trained. That’s the first step always, but then there are also other steps. So you need to do mentoring hours. Maybe you need to do like a record.
You need to work on your craft always. It’s, it’s a craft and it’s not like when you attend two, three days of training, that’s it. You’re fine. You can go and do it. It doesn’t work this way. It’s a skill that needs some time to, to acquire, right? I cannot tell you that I’m going to teach you to swim in three days and you’ll be amazed.
No, that’s not how it works. Yeah, well, well, Hamza, I just have to say, man, it’s been great having you on the show and learning more about what you’re doing and also just your passion for coaching. It comes through, comes, jumps right through the camera. I just have to ask, what’s next? I mean, what’s next for you?
What’s next for the coaching? What’s next for leadership? Like what’s next on your plate? Well, what’s next for me? It’s a, it’s a big question, to be honest. I think for me, it’s I really want to achieve great things with my company. And five days I will be here for. Almost a year and i love this company and i see great future there’s so many things i would like to do in this domain and personally i think one of the things is i would like to.
I have some free time to maybe write something about leadership and coaching. Get some, and some leadership content, man. You’ve been studying for a long time. I’m in, I’m in, I already got it. I see it. I see it. I’m excited about it. I know this is just a one, one piece of your plan is is getting more out there to, to inspire others, and I love to see you continue to create content.
So I think it’s amazing that being said, if somebody’s watching this to listening to this, and if they want to follow up, cause they maybe want to learn. Mercer talent enterprise, or they want to learn about the coaching side of things or anything else. I mean, what’s the best way for people to follow your journey?
I think LinkedIn would be the best channel for people to reach me and I’m sure you’ll make this available for people. So so yeah, I think LinkedIn would be the. Yeah. So for everybody watching this, we’ll put the link to to the show or excuse me, to Hamza’s LinkedIn profile, all that other good stuff in the show notes, so you can just click on the links and head right on over and speaking of the audience, if this is your first time with mission matters and you haven’t done it yet, hit that subscribe button because we have many more mission based individuals coming up on the line and we don’t want you to miss a thing.
Hamza again, thank you so much for coming on the show and I can’t wait till the next time. I thank you. Thank you very much, Adam. That was lovely. Thank you so much.